
John Kenny in Conversation with Mark Valentine about Mark’s new collection Lost Estates.
Mark Valentine is the author of several volumes of short stories including The Collected Connoisseur (Tartarus Press 2010) and Secret Europe (Ex Occidente Press 2012), both shared titles with John Howard. He has also written a biography of Arthur Machen (Seren 1990); and Time, a Falconer (Tartarus Press 2011), a study of the diplomat and fantasist “Sarban”. His books with Swan River Press include Selected Stories (2012) and Seventeen Stories (2013), both collections of his short fiction, and The Far Tower (2019), an original anthology of stories in celebration of W. B. Yeats.
John Kenny: Your previous collections published by Swan River Press focused on Middle Europe between the wars. This time out the focus is more on aspects of folk horror. There exists a strong tradition of folk horror that’s deeply rooted in the English rural landscape. Why do you think that is? And can you tell me who your inspirations are in this regard?
Mark Valentine: I’d like to plead “not guilty” to “folk horror”! I prefer a couple of terms I came upon recently in contemporary 1923 reviews of Uncanny Stories by May Sinclair and Visible and Invisible by E. F. Benson. The publisher, presumably with these authors’ agreement, called them “borderland” and “otherworld” stories, evidently terms then in use and well understood for occult and supernatural fiction. I think they do convey better the sense that can sometimes be felt in certain places of being close to a different realm. I’ve certainly had that experience several times and I appreciate in particular the work of writers who have also tried to express this sense of the numinous, such as Arthur Machen, Mary Butts, Forrest Reid, Jocelyn Brooke, John Cowper Powys and quite a few others in the field. For me, this was also bound up with my discovery in my late teens and early twenties of ancient mysteries books and journals, such as Mysterious Britain by Janet & Colin Bord and its sequels, which made exploring antiquities and remote landscapes seem exciting and strange, as if the world of Machen and these similar writers still existed.
JK: I really like that term “borderland”. Folk horror does seem to be largely connected to rural settings, whereas a couple of your stories in Lost Estates take place in cities: “And maybe the parakeet was correct” and “The End of Alpha Street”. I do think city streets and houses can accrete this sense of the numinous you’ve referred to. I’m thinking of some of Peter Ackroyd’s work, such as Hawksmoor, and that of Iain Sinclair and the whole concept of psychogeography. Is this a concept you think has validity?
MV: Yes, I admire the work of Iain Sinclair too and particularly the way he uses modernist literary techniques in his prose: the supernatural fiction field can sometimes seem a bit fusty and it’s good to see a more contemporary style: another example of a more radical approach would be M. John Harrison. And in fact Machen is now seen as a precursor of psychogeography, with his interest in wandering the back-streets and lonely quarters of London, as seen in The London Adventure, or, The Art of Wandering and with his flâneur Mr. Dyson. My friend and colleague John Howard does this to fine effect too, in his London stories. My understanding of the original concept of psychogeography is that it involves “aimless wandering”, the aimlessness being vital: ambling around just for the sake of it and seeing what transpires. I can see that this might lead to a heightened receptivity, where chance encounters and signs begin to seem significant: again, an approach Machen uses in his stories.
JK: There is certainly a sense of aimless wandering in “The House of Flame”, where the main character takes to the London streets, although he is in search of a kind of spiritual awakening. The story centres around the death in 1885 of Charles George Gordon, who is also referenced in another story in Lost Estates. What drew you to the story of Gordon of Khartoum?
MV: Well, in my childhood there was a series of colourful cards of Famous People given away with boxes of Brooke Bond tea. I was very interested in history and I enjoyed collecting these. The two that appealed to me most were not, as perhaps they should have been, social reformers and scientists, but two enigmatic soldiers: General Gordon and Lawrence of Arabia. No doubt it was because they seemed more mysterious. Later, I read in one of Machen’s autobiographical volumes his recollection of bringing the news of the fall of Khartoum to his father in the rectory at Llandewi, using his schoolboy Greek. This vignette stuck in my memory, and so when I was asked to contribute to a Machen-themed anthology I imagined a version of the youthful Machen and what the figure of Gordon might have meant to him.
JK: While Gordon couldn’t be considered a social reformer, he was actively involved in suppressing the slave trade in Sudan while he was there. I note that many of your stories use as a jumping off point an actual historical event, as in “The Fifth Moon”, which looks at the disappearance of King John’s treasure in 1216. Do you find that having an actual event at the heart of a story lends credibility or is it more a case of your interest in history acting as inspiration?
MV: I am interested in the way that history, legend, and literature interweave. I’ve been following the latest historical thinking on the figure of Arthur, which is now highly sceptical about not only any factual basis for such a king or warlord, but even the whole Britons vs Saxons story. It just isn’t supported by current archaeology or newly available genetic studies. Probably that will need to be refined further as research and analysis continues: the discipline of history itself is always changing. In the case of King John’s treasure, I was already familiar with the lonely landscape around North Norfolk and South Lincolnshire where the loss occurred and so enjoyed setting the story there, and it is an enduring mystery which still fascinates people today: treasure hunts are always thrilling. I also relished studying the various accounts of the incident and trying to trace exactly what was said at the time and how that has been changed through the centuries, making the story more alluring and romantic. In my own researches, for example on legends of the last wolf in England and on the origins of inns signs, I’ve tried to go back to the very earliest sources. They often tell a quite different story to the current one, and that is the case with King John’s treasure too. Then, of course, the imagination comes into play and I began to wonder just what was lost, and what might survive.
JK: It is a fascinating piece of history, yes. It’s clear that not a little research goes in to many of your stories and that’s part of what makes them so compelling. Your mention of inn signs, for example, which is the main subject of “The Understanding of the Signs” and is also an element in “Worse Things Than Serpents”; I’m curious to know if the specifics of the signs mentioned are true. And do the books listed exist?
MV: Yes, all of the inn sign books mentioned in that story are real and almost all of the books the narrator finds in “Worse Things Than Serpents” too. Inn signs have interested me since I was young too: on family journeys I would write down the names of all those we passed, and later started with a friend an inn signs newsletter. When I came back to studying them, I found that the usual explanations for the most popular signs simply don’t hold up. They can often be traced to a stout Victorian study but even there were often advanced tentatively. It’s another example of stories repeated through the ages that only have the thinnest basis. But when you do start to ask what is the origin of the signs, you uncover a much richer and more varied set of possibilities. Also, they seem part of what I have called “folk heraldry”, the popular enjoyment of strange beasts and monsters as local symbols.
JK: Which feeds very much into the history of an area or locality and how people interact or become part of that landscape. I’m thinking of “Fortunes Told: Fresh Samphire” and its possible companion piece “The Readers of the Sands” (by virtue of the fact that they both feature a character named Crabbe). The sense of place in your stories is very well realised. Have you visited all the places in which your stories are set?
MV: Some of the places I know very well but others I haven’t visited at all. But when I’m writing a story I like to have a clear idea of the setting, by studying maps, looking at old postcards, reading old walking guides. I try to imagine just what the character might see, hear and smell in that particular season. What would their journey there be like, what would they do when they got there, what route would they take to their destination? In “A Chess Game at Michaelmas”, for example, the custom in question is a perfectly genuine one and it belongs to a house located just where I describe, though I have adapted it a bit fictionally. So in writing the story I worked out where was then the nearest railway station, and what would be the way the narrator gets from there to the house on foot. As it happens, that would take him past some ancient stones with interesting lore, also genuine, though again adapted slightly.
JK: “A Chess Game at Michaelmas” is one of my favourites in this collection. And the journey to the house is as much an integral part of the story as the custom in question. As is your reference to yew trees in this and a couple of other stories in Lost Estates. Is there a particular significance to these references?
MV: Yes, I have a fondness for slightly overgrown or semi-wild gardens, that point where the art of the gardener has been reclaimed and reshaped somewhat by nature. Topiary, often with yew trees, is already beguiling because of its figuring into strange shapes and when it’s a bit neglected it looks wilder still. I like that blend of artistry, pageantry and yet melancholy they seem to convey.
JK: With the demise of Wormwood, the magazine of fantasy, the supernatural and decadent literature, which you edited, is the primary focus for you now on your own writing? And is there a novel in you or is the short form your first love?
MV: Well, I still contribute to the Wormwoodiana shared blog, where we try to cover similar books and authors to those we might have featured in the journal. I’m usually following up discoveries from my book-collecting expeditions, which may lead to further essays. I even dream about browsing in bookshops, and sometimes remember titles from the dream shelves.
I’m currently working on an anthology of essays about Malcolm Lowry and his use of magic and myth, which I think are quite important themes in his books. As to fiction, I’ve enjoyed in more recent years writing longer stories (typically 12,000-15,000 words) and would like to try a few more of those, but I don’t think I have a novel lurking anywhere. I like the short story form and I think it still has a lot of possibilities.
Buy a copy of Lost Estates.
If you’d like, you can read John Kenny’s full review of Lost Estates.

A brief side note, albeit a morbid one: Mangan penned an addendum noting that Edgeworth died during the composition of his sketch. Edgeworth died on 22 May 1849; the sketch was published on the 26th of the same month; Mangan himself scarcely survived another month, dying on 20 June 1849. Edgeworth was buried in the churchyard at St. John’s in Edgeworthstown; Mangan rests in Glasnevin Cemetery on the northside of Dublin.
“I’ll show you what horror means!” – Frederic March as Mr. Hyde
I was also invited to David’s Halloween party that year. David loved Halloween—of course he did! He wrote a book on it!—and the party was yet another manifestation of that lifelong condition since identified by medical experts as “Monster Kid”. It’s that fundamental impulse that drives some of us. You’ll know in your heart if you’re afflicted and will be familiar with the associated symptoms. David was absolutely stricken by it. He threw the party for his students and Trinity colleagues; I wasn’t affiliated with Trinity at all though, but I was glad to be welcomed. However, though not then a student, it is in large part due to David that I thought . . . perhaps I’d like to do a masters at Trinity. I enrolled the very next year.
Another thing people seemed to notice about David when they met him, certainly I did, was his charming and urbane manner—and that voice! It was authoritative, but so warm and inviting. He wanted to share his passions with you. If you’ve seen the documentaries that he’s hosted or narrated, you’ll know his presence and what I mean. David was a natural storyteller, and I recall fondly listening to his memories, how he’d fished sheaves of old archives from a dumpster at Universal Studios, including, remarkably, correspondence from Stoker’s widow Florence—this was to become the backbone of his landmark book Hollywood Gothic (1990). David himself, in his dedication to and celebration of the silver screen, seemed to become a living repository for memories of an era, of the people he’d met, interviewed, and written about over his life, including David Manners, who played Harker in Tod Browning’s Dracula (1931). He also knew Carla Laemmle, Lupita Tovar, Ricou Browning (The Creature from the Black Lagoon was always my favourite!), Sarah Karloff, Raymond Huntley, and so many more. How wonderful that someone like David came along when he did, just as some of those memories of Old Hollywood, those connections to the distant past, were about to fade.
One final memory, perhaps my favourite: David was staying with me in July 2012 on one of his return trips to Dublin. He had asked if I would take publicity photos for him, photos he has since used for the past decade or so. I’m no professional, but David was, and he knew exactly what he wanted, so I obliged. We trounced around Mount Jerome Cemetery in south Dublin looking for perfect backdrops; they were plentiful. David posed and pulled faces for me while I inexpertly snapped away. Rain threatened, but David wanted to use an umbrella as a prop anyway. When Something in the Blood was published, I felt delighted to read David’s warm inscription and acknowledgement note—but also on the jacket’s rear flap was produced one of the photos from the day we shared in Mount Jerome. Before we’d left the house that morning, David asked me, “Do you have a tie I could borrow?” I did. Now, whenever I see those photos—and they’re reproduced a lot, especially now—I feel a special connection. That tie always makes me laugh and remember. I still have it too.


Today is the 20th anniversary of Swan River Press.
These chapbooks were followed by three series of booklets, A5 in size, some staple-bound and others hand-sewn. There was the Haunted Histories Series, which allowed me to work with a few contemporary writers whose stories I’d been enjoying at the time, while the Stoker Series and Le Fanu Series were ways to stretch my editorial, design, and research skills a bit more. Why the format change from chapbook to booklet? Well, the chapbooks took an inordinate amount of time to create. If you’ve got one, you’re lucky! The booklets were easier to do as they didn’t require as much precise cutting and folding. I won’t be doing chapbooks again any time soon.
While much writing made it into the hardback publications, not everything could be given such treatment. Inspired by Tartarus Press’s journal Wormwood, in 2013 I launched
I just wanted to take the opportunity with this blog post to thank all of you for the support you’ve shown over the years. I’ve always striven to produce the highest quality I’m capable of offering, and I’m fairly certain the Swan River team, past and present, has maintained that these past two decades. It’s not always been easy. There has always been hard work and certainly much sacrifice. Whatever the case, here we are. There’s more work to be done. I’m prepared to carry on. And I promise I’ll get around to writing a bibliography one of these days.
John Birchall, United Kingdom
David Johnson, United States
“Editor’s Note”
Douglas A. Anderson submitted a year ago an uncollected piece entitled “Black Spirits and White” by Henry Irving—or perhaps not? As Anderson conjectures in his brief note introducing the tale, there is a possibility that Stoker himself might have penned the piece (Mystery #2). Alas, we will likely never learn the answer, however you’re welcome to draw your own conclusion.
I hope you’ll allow me a further indulgence, but I’m running one of my own articles in this issue—an essay with which readers of the late, lamented journal Wormwood might already be familiar. In “Bram Stoker and Another Dracula”, I discuss whether or not Stoker ever intended to write a sequel to Dracula (Mystery #3). It’s a question that fascinates me, and I think I’ve come up with a pretty good answer—but we can never know for sure. This essay was inspired by a paraphrased “interview” with Stoker that appeared in an issue of The Occult Review, just months before his passing in April 1912. In this piece, Mr. Stoker divulges some curious titbits, which I make use of in my own essay. I won’t spoil the surprise, but I thought it worth reprinting this interview in its entirety as well.

Conducted by Brian J. Showers
Alison Moore (“Where Are They Now?”)
Méabh de Brún (“Consumed as in Obsessed”)

I did rewrite to create further connective tissue: I’d just read Keith Ridgway’s Hawthorn and Child. The best way to describe it is Derek Raymond-style occult crime, but the novel is totally fragmentary with no linear narrative—and I thought why not try and make the stories work like that—with a sense that they aggregate meaning when you put them in the context of the collection.
TJJ: There’s also a reference to a writer from Gary Budden’s fictional work—I use an author created by him in London Incognita in “We Recognise Our Own”. But it’s Chambers’ The King in Yellow (and by extension Bierce’s “An Inhabitant of Carcosa”, I guess) that was my real inspiration in doing that sort of thing.
JM: And there you get the idea of the archive and found documents—the “Archive of Dread”, as
TJJ: Either I don’t remember my dreams or I don’t dream—for me, the act of writing fiction performs the function of dreams for most people. I actually need to sit down at the laptop in order to undertake that necessary psychological process.
TJJ: Living in Bedford and working in Luton was really important for the collection. The pub in Luton which is in a couple of the stories—the Bricklayers Arms—is a real place. My dad’s side of the family are from Luton and I grew up in Bedford. When I moved to London I was very into
JM: Yes, so in terms of the conversations people have in your stories, they’re not realistic conversations. It’s the opposite of naturalistic and very intentionally so . . .
JM: But he lived such a High-Tory bourgeois life.
TJJ: Yes, the thing is that I don’t believe in evil; I’m interested in the affect of ecstasy and the affect of loss.
Living for four years in Dublin was the best possible preparation for appreciating that London could never be excavated in that way. London was not a project for me. It was the curse that never stops giving. A Faustian contract to be worked out through fortunate collaborations, in poetry, film, performance, pilgrimage. Pulling away from London gravity was never successful. Those books were barely noticed or permitted. The point was to live there, to begin with the first step outside my Hackney door. To dig in, to stay. To honour characters who presented themselves and demanded a cameo.
I should say that the stories were put together in a posthumous dialogue with Brian Catling. And as a companion piece to
While the literary/film characters of the book fill the pages, it is the peppering in of people like William Lyttle that add an extra dimension to your writing. (Less of a question and more calling out an aspect I loved. On second reading, I sat with Google by my side and fell down many enjoyable/educational rabbit holes, was that your intention?) That kind of interplay between a text and the digital world didn’t exist twenty years ago—what, if any, impact do you think that has had on your writing?
Sinclair: I don’t know how “natural” the process is. But there is no pecking order: maps are usually involved, but I might not consult them until the walks are done. And those maps tend to be so old that they have the charm of fiction. Key buildings and sites have vanished. The latest interventions are not yet admitted. The Secret State redacts inconvenient military installations, pharmaceutical and “experimental” facilities. London documentation has to ooze through the cracks in forbidden zones. There is a perpetual struggle to outperform CGI boasts and projections. Writing is a dangerous negotiation. You pay a price to be admitted to the game.
“Editor’s Note”
As a companion to “A Woman Without a Soul”, we also present a selection of poetry by Gyles, possibly the first such assembly of poems by “the girl with very bright red hair and an eager face”, as Ella Young once called her. According to Arthur Symons, in a letter to Thomas B. Mosher (5 July 1904), Gyles did once assemble a collection a poetry, which she had submitted to a willing publisher. However, the collection never appeared due to the publisher’s objection to her dedication: “to the beautiful memory of Oscar Wilde”. Even if the publisher could overcome the then “tarnished” reputation of Wilde, who died in November 1900, he nevertheless insisted that the word “beautiful” still be removed. Gyles, who harboured a profound adoration for Wilde her entire life, withdrew the collection. For the most part, her poems languished in newspapers and magazines, uncollected, many never even reprinted, until now. With the assistance of Simon Cooke and Ana Portillo, we’ve assembled the largest selection of Gyles’s poetry hitherto published. We feel it only appropriate, for this presentation, to reinstate Althea’s original dedication to Oscar.
Finally, we’d like to introduce you to the equally enigmatic Mary Frances McHugh (1899-1955), whose work, according to Jim Rockhill’s assessment, has fallen into oblivion. In the mid-1930s, McHugh contributed a trio of macabre, dream-like vignettes to a pair of anthologies edited by John Gawsworth. Her stories sit beside those by M. R. James, Arthur Machen, Dorothy L. Sayers, and Agatha Christie—however, unlike these writers, McHugh is now all but forgotten. Near as I can tell, these are her only stories written in the genre. Has anyone else found any further tales or learned more details about this elusive writer?